It's all about me(n)

[theatokos]

10,000 BC. I saw it. Last night, with Adam, alizarin71 and our upstairs neighbor. It was a fun outing. But SUCH a stupid movie. It is possible that my extreme tiredness made me prone to the severe crankiness I experienced upon leaving the theatre. Besides being a ridiculous hodgepodge of culture, archeological, geographical and historical elements and being pretty dull in plot, the film also triggered one of my major pet peeves: a movie made by men all about men, featuring nothing but men (I'm sorry, two women characters don't count).

Yet when I enumerate the good things about this film I wonder why I'm so annoyed. Here are the good things about the movie:
+Beautifully shot, great art design, nice music
+Features hardly any white people!! *(BUT...)
+The love interest saves herself at the end *
+Great values - loyalty, keeping your word, being brave, stepping up to responsibility, affection between men, banding together in unity makes great things possible *
+Very well done special effects
+No sex or nudity or swearing (how rare is that in a grown up movie??)

I want to add silly escapist fun to that list, but honestly the movie was kind of boring. Very formulaic. We know what's going to happen. Let's get to those Buts:
-There were hardly any white people, or at least plain white faces. However, the two whitest faces were the main man and woman. Perhaps I'm just picking a fight on this point, but I don't think so. There was some legend about a blue eyed woman, blah blah blah, so the main girl wore these horrible blue contacts, making her look vapid since her pupils never changed in size. Not something we think about normally, but try reading a face whose pupils never alter. Weird.

-The love interest/main woman (Evolet) does indeed save herself when she is taken by one of the baddies in the end. Which was great. And she does show strength of character and resourcefulness throughout the film. But the movie isn't about her, even though she's the reason D'let (main guy) goes on this journey. Evolet is a woman to whom things happen. In that regard she is a completely passive woman. Her lines, which are few, consist mainly of "You came back for me" "You left me behind" etc. Pah! The other woman is the main tribal elder, the seer-woman. But she also doesn't DO anything. Again, she is a passive woman to whom visions come. I AM SO BORED WITH THIS FEMALE TROPE.

-The values of the film are great. I wholly support them - for men or for women. Yet repeatedly these values are only demonstrated by men and discussed in male terms. There is a great set of lines where Tik'tik, D'let's mentor and tribal chief, tells D'let that "Every man draws a circle around himself. For most men that involves himself, his woman and his children. Some men draw a larger circle that encompasses his larger family and maybe his tribe. But some men draw an even bigger circle that encompasses even more people." (paraphrased, emphasis mine) I guess women don't need to think about their own boundaries since we're just objects to be won and bred with. Where are the movies showing women acting valiantly, with strength and honor and dedication to a higher cause? Oh, I'm sure they're out there, but let's also clarify this: where are those movies with women embodying those values without being martyrs or at the expense of their male counterparts?

I also think that so many of modern middle class films employ the "band together and rise up against injustice/usurpers!" motif and I am continually confused by this. Do we like this and relate because it reminds us of our early American history? Because we sure as hell ain't banding together to overthrow injustice, tyranny or theocracy today. In the film, the tribal people band together to free their people from slavery at the hands of the greedy, religiously insane proto-Egyptians building their pyramidical symbols of power and largesse. So we root for these tribes - they are in the right! Down with tyranny! But do we connect this kind of injustice with sweat shop labor? Or migrant produce pickers? Or sex trafficking? Or even religious hegemony in our own modern politics? Of course we don't. Do we just live vicariously through these characters? That's my guess. Better to support honor and loyalty and bravery in the face of injustice in fictional characters than have to be those things ourselves.

Ok, I may be taking a silly movie out of context. Sure. Each movie on it's own is fine, but when we have the vast majority of films with this sort of structure, and CERTAINLY the vast majority of films made by men about men for men, I do not think I'm overreacting. [This is where I get shit for loving 300. I do see the irony, the hypocrisy. I still maintain that 300 is camp. I also still have no problem with people liking individual films. Hell, if I hated every misogynist, patriarchal film I'd never like anything. By the way, no comments on 300. I'm looking at you Alizarin!]

As an experiment, I decided to reorder my netflix queue to reflect movies about women (for example, Fellini films about women don't count) or by women - 22 out of 170. I've decided that I need a break from all this maleness. So for some undefined period of time I will only listen to music by women, watch films about women and/or by women, and read books by and/or about women. Depending how long I decide to do this I may have to make an exception in June for the first opera in Wagner's Ring Cycle at the SF Opera. And of course, there's the new Batman film coming out this summer AND the Ironman movie (both movies made by men about men, superheroes no less) starring the immeasurably wonderful Robert Downy Jr. But those I can catch on DVD if need be.

It's not that I hate men, it's that I loathe the patriarchy.

Comments

[msmidge.livejournal.com]

Where else do you see the "band together...etc." theme? I'm curious where you see it, if anywhere, because I've been thinking in an unsystematic way about a lot of what I read online about natural parenting, especially resistance to vaccinating children. It's not "band together" per se, but I think there is some kind of serious anti-authoritarian thing going on in it that I don't understand. It's often phrased as being about "choice" and "individuality" and stuff like that, but people are so adamant about it that there is clearly more going on than just making a choice.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

I am referring to the Band Together themes in movies. It's everywhere, and if you want a list, I'll do some research to make a list - but 300, Band of Brothers, immediately come to mind. Basically, any Us vs Them movie is about men.

I haven't even thought about vaccinations yet! Yipes. Might want to do that. I am very uninformed about this. I think there are all kinds of grassroots movements, particularly around natural parenting and birth, but so many of these things are still on the fringe and still populated mainly by white, educated, middle class folk. Until a larger segment of the population gets involved there and until it gathers more public momentum these sorts of changes will only be piecemeal. I think of food politics and the much more visible platforms for change that occur in that movement, yet it still has very little leverage power in the realms of those that actually make policy.

[thekitchenvixen.livejournal.com]

I didn't watch the movie.
But thank you for making me feel like I'm not a conspiracy theorist. Or at least like I'm not the only one.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

You know, it's so hard to be so very critical of this stuff. Especially with all of the good points I enumerated. The men really were good men. And I am so blessed to be surrounded by loving, amazing men who get it- in fact, one of the first comments out of ALizarin's mouth was "you'd think a strong woman from a warrior tribe would do more." Yeah, you would! But still, as a woman, a critical thinking, observant woman I just feel beat down sometimes by the All (White) Men, All the Time state of the world.

I also really struggle with bringing another white privileged male into the world. I know that I can raise him to be awesome like his father and our male friends, but still. I hate to admit it, but I was really bummed after watching the movie to think that there was a penis inside me. I'm not proud of this. It's part of my continuing personal struggle.

Sorry to be long...I'm still working some of this out for myself

[erinya.livejournal.com]

I think you have valid concerns about bringing a privileged white male into the world. I don't mean that you should value your baby boy less--as you say, you have the opportunity to raise a real, 21st-century, feminist man, and our world needs him as much as we need empowered, feminist daughters. But I was having a discussion this weekend with my friend (white, Christian) and her husband (a Filipino Jew) about the blindness of white male (straight, Christian) privilege and how it seems it's almost impossible for someone born into that to understand what it means to belong to an underprivileged group. Notably, my male Filipino friend strongly agreed with me; my white female friend, somewhat but less so.

As an educated white woman, I benefit from a great deal of privilege myself, but my experience of femaleness in this society gives me at least a modicum of insight into what it means to be on the flip side of privilege. In dating SWMs, by contrast, I've found that most of them have a near-total lack of personal context to understand the challenges faced by marginalized groups, which is of course part of the way privilege operates: they don't have to think about it. (The exceptions are either unusually empathic or long-time members of diverse social groups--continuing education by exposure, which is my other saving grace. Or not full exceptions after all because they belong to an "invisible" minority.) This manifests as a noticeable handicap in discussing race, gender, orientation, culture, and the general importance of protecting the rights of minority groups. They have no visceral understanding of what's at stake and what the obstacles are--even when they're trying, they often miss the point. So there's a great challenge inherent in raising a WM who can understand, more so than in raising awareness in a girl-child. (Although there are plenty of women in my generation and younger who are missing that awareness, to their detriment.)

I use the words "handicap" and "blindness" intentionally--the patriarchal mindset truly cripples/delays its seeming beneficiaries' experience of culture and community. Part of privilege is not seeing one's own privilege. And if they cannot perceive the problem, they are unable to fix it; they cannot be healers without the ability to see the wounds.

I think you and Adam can raise your boy to be a non-patriarchal, privilege-aware, vagina-respecting penis owner. :-) But it's good to know what you're up against, to know that you'll be swimming upstream in teaching him those values.

(Note: this is not to say that belonging to any minority will prevent anyone from being unaware of their privileged outlook. It just helps in sensitization.)

Re: Sorry to be long...I'm still working some of this out for myself

[alizarin71.livejournal.com]

While I agree that privilege brings with it the added privilege of seeming invisible, and while little boys and girls continue to be drawn to externally-defined gender roles, the fact is that we learn patriarchy first and foremost at home. As such, I don't think Ewigweibliche's little boy will have any excuse to act in the way that you describe, which we would all consider like a jerk--just as her little girl would have every reason to live as her strong, proud self.

There's no need to swim upstream when all a boy wants (what he really, really wants) is to be bravely loving and humanely great. I can't help but think of this expected little boy that way.

Re: Sorry to be long...I'm still working some of this out for myself

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

AWWWW.... You make me all soft and mushy on the inside! Plus, you just quoted the Spice Girls, me thinks, and that too makes me giddy!


ps- it's just crazy that this little guy will be here in 3 months! Sometimes I get a little sad because it's not going to be just me and Adam anymore. Other times, I'm really excited to meet this person. But I can definitely wait on the sleepless nights and poopy diapers. Wait- that's why you're thinking of moving, isn't it? You just don't want to babysit.... I get it.

Re: Sorry to be long...I'm still working some of this out for myself

[alizarin71.livejournal.com]

Definite shout-out to the Spice Girls. Girl Power!

I don't know what you're talking about with the getting-out-of-babysitting...er...is this the back way out?

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

I watched the movie....and while it wasn't great..I can't fault how it portrayed women. I mean...the Womens' Movement just didn't have much critical mass back then.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Sorry, Ms Snowcalla. Not letting you get away with that excuse! That ENTIRE film was anachronistic. Nothing historical about AT ALL. Don't tell me that in a made up movie the women should at least be played historically accurate.

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

You mean the entire film was a load of crap. *grin* As a tale...it was OK. As a historical...load of crap.

But...nothing ticks me off faster than when even crap movies go the "Girl Power" route when there is no way it would have gone down that way *back then*. If either female would have started acting like a trained warrior...I would have yelled "Bullshit" and walked out. I find that (gratutious Girl Power) more insulting to women, as if we are so stupid, pathetic, and hard up that we would actually believe/accept that crap. Please. I'm just fine and have plenty of female role models, thankyouverymuch, and won't be relying on Hollywood for that.

As it was...it was a close deal anyway for me walking out. In fact...my husband grabbed my arm when the friggin pyramids came into sight. I think I did say "Bullshit" then.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

I also did much eye-rolling and muttered a few "oh my gods" (not the good ones) out loud.

However, I am going to have to compose myself for a little bit before I reply to this. Since I respect you very much and know you to be a strong and smart woman I want to choose my words carefully, because I COMPLETELY DISAGREE WITH YOU.

To be continued.

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

*laughs*

hmmmmm....it sounds like you're trying hard not to say "fuck you, you idiot". I'll thank you for holding off. I'll look for your post later.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Ok. I have chilled out some and eaten (that last one being so important these days) and feel like I can perhaps hold a discussion! I admit, I have been a raging cranky bitch lately and I do feel very strongly about feminist issues, so I didn't want to go off on you. Really, it's not you, it's me. :)

I hear what you say about "gratuitous Girl Power" - usually it's just wussy "empowerfullment" that's a load of crap. Sexy warrior girls - a cheap hand out to women and still sexy for the guys! It's like a back handed compliment. And proves that smart, powerful women still aren't taken seriously.

Honestly, 10000BC isn't the worst offender, I was (am) just cranky and bored with the film. But I am annoyed at the general portrayal of women in film and media. I don't think there are plenty of role models, although I don't doubt that a smart, independent woman such as yourself (and me!) has found plenty of role models on your own. I also don't rely on Hollywood for my role models, but Hollywood does shape a lot of people's perceptions, particularly younger people's. Women in media continue to be portrayed primarily as passive and as sexualized objects. This bothers me a great deal. It reflects what society in general accepts. And the general acceptance of this crap frustrates me and makes me sad.

Your statements above only raise my alarms because it's easy to say "well, I'M not in need of Hollywood's approval!" and then dismiss a very powerful force in our society for shaping attitudes toward women. Or to say "Well, I'M not oppressed by the patriarchy, so whatever" which dismisses the fact that so many women ARE oppressed. Just because I am not personally touched by a particular issue (abortion has rarely been a personal issue in my life, nor has domestic violence -thanks be to Allah) doesn't mean that it's not important and vital to women in the world for these issues to be dealt with and spoken about.

Again, this movie is not the worst offender and I know I'm making a bigger deal of this film than is necessary. My hackles were up. I mean, there is any number of juvenile films more degrading to women out there - and they are often big big sellers.

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

hmmmm...I've been thinking about this and these are some of my thoughts....not in any order - they may leap around a bit.

Have I been on the short end of the stick at times? Yes. I have been raped. I have had a boss give me the "fuck or walk" option. I have had people be jerks to me because of my gender and they made a point of letting me know that. So it's not like I live in a fantasy land. I don't.

This used to pissed me off. (and it still does, but in another way) I would get angry at how "society" treated women. How society depicted women. I decried films, books, advertisments, etc.

But society is us. And I don't know about you...but I am an individual, with my own hopes, fears, experiences, dreams, and attitudes. I can be nice and I can be an asshole. I turn into a serious asshole when someone tries to treat me like...some nameless mass, not as the individual that I am.

Everyone out there is an individual. They have a choice in how they will treat their fellow human beings and in how they will react to situations. Some people will always choose to be jerks and will treat others like shit for no good reason. No amount of changing their environment will change that. We can have every awesome movie, book, role models, etc...and they will still be class A assholes.

I can only control my behaviour - that's all I can do. I choose to not give a shit about race, gender, religion in how I treat other humans. To me, they are all humans. Period. If more people made that choice, we would see change in this world. The change, the decision can only come from within each individual, it can't be imposed from the outside. (Although we can punish outward behavior)

Controlling my reaction - internally and externally...that's another thing I can do. That's a power that I have. I do not need anyones' permission or approval to be equal, to have worth. While others may do things to me, they do not change the condition of my Being, what I AM. Here is part of the difference...I was raped 19 years ago. I allowed myself to rape myself everyday for about 7 years after that.

I think too many women still look to men (society) to grant them the approval of being equal. You said that one of the things that bothered you in the film was the chick saying things like "you came back for me" or "you left me behind". Isn't that what many women say today? "You haven't validated how awesome I am by making better movies about women." That kind of thing. It's still waiting for others, and holding them responsible, for your (plural, general) sense of worth. Their approval is not needed. Sounds corny...but I do believe in "Be the change you wish to see in the world" - because you ARE the world. You are not insignifigant, powerless, beholden.

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

Off on a tangent...Endurance is strength. I'm thinking of the the movie again, but other things also. Historically, men have been pushed to show outward strength, be the warrior. Women were pushed to show inward strength, to endure, have staying power. Now it is more OK for women to be the warrior, and we look down on enduring as being passive and weak - we only value the warrior type of strength. It's not. It's harder. A researcher wanted to know why, when villages were taken by another into slavery, greater numbers of women lived than men. It was assumed that more of the men were killed during battle and that the women were treated better as slaves since the men would want to fuck them. After researching how this currently plays out...more men were killed. But a larger percentage of men than women died after they were made slaves. The women usually received worse physical abuse, less food, and had worse conditions than the male slaves...yet women survived in a great percentage. Why? Because the men would only take so much before they mentally and spiritually gave up and then they died. The women endured...they dug in and no matter what came their way...they endured and some of them rose from the ashes. That is strength too. It isn't flashy, we don't see it as heroic, there are no ballads sung about it. Isn't that a bit sad? Isn't it sad that even other women can't see the value, the worth in that kind of strength? (And to be clear...I'm not talking about staying voluntarily in a bad, evil, or abusive situation)

As another aside...it saddens me that you aren't very excited that you are having a baby boy. I'm not knocking on you one bit, believe me. But you are going to give birth to a human being. That's it. A unique human being who can do great things or horrible things, but will leave a mark upon the world. How he treats others and what he does with his life is what's important - not what gender he is. That is so unimportant. But it can't BE unimportant unless we decide for ourselves that it IS unimportant. And Damn society, damn what they think or do...this is your child...who carries the spark of the Divine within him just as you do.

ok...this is long....and it rambled and is probably not real clear.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Again, I agree absolutely. I think patriarchy fucks it up for men too. I am really really blessed to have so many wonderful men in my life - all different kinds, expressing themselves in complex ways, unafraid to be vulnerable and strong and dorky and "manly" and "feminine" all in one bundle. Just as I know women who embody so many complex aspects of being human. Patriarchy isn't about me being anti-man, it's really anti-powers that be and the uncritical social forces that encourage the status quo, usually to maintain unjust systems of power and the bottom line.

As for me and my issues with having a boy..... it's hard to talk about because, again, I agree with you and in one part of me I totally get excited about this little life in me. I know I will be so excited to meet him - I am already. His father is an incredible example of what it means to be a man in this world, as is his namesake/uncle, and I couldn't be more confident that he's got a great headstart in the world.

But, sadly, it does raise some black murky gunk that's not had to be dealt with until now. I'm constantly surprised at my own anger and issues, as well as disappointed in my own disappointment! Clearly, I've got some reverse sexism going on! I admit it and I'm working to deal with it before my little guy arrives.

I want to add to all of this that your perspectives and experiences are of immense value to me. I think you are incredibly thoughtful and bold - qualities I admire in all of my friends. I love that we don't agree on everything, but we seem to agree on the fundamental principles, we just want those things maybe expressed slightly differently.

And thanks for the stern talking to about my boy. As a hot-head, I need that from time to time!

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

Not stern...I had all kinds of isues to face when I was pregnant. It was just sooo...emotional.

*laughs* I remember ripping a book apart, literally shredding it, because I was pissed at the book, the author, the world.

I can also say that once I held my sweet little baby...it was all good. When I look at him...I can't even describe it to you. But I really do see that spark of the Divine in his eyes and his heart. It chokes me up and my heart sings.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Absolutely. I agree with all of this. Too many women do look to men for approval and validation. And to the larger society as a whole. We are individuals - and we should hold ourselves and each other accountable for our personal actions. I am big on accountability. And that spills over into me holding media and government accountable too.

Sadly, I don't think accountability is encouraged or supported, nor is critical thinking. While I can't control what people or groups produce or what people choose to think or how they express themselves, I do think that many people - particularly those in positions of power- get away with bullshit because no one is calling them on their bullshit. Anytime we can speak out and discuss bullshit is good. I'm in no way calling for a censor to stop movies I think are stupid, but by talking about why I think it's stupid I can raise awareness of this stuff.

Again, this movie was not the right film to get all worked up over!

[howilearned.livejournal.com]

I would venture to say that almost any movie coming out of Hollywood is ultimately about us versus them. To me, being a writer of stories, its an engaging premise because it reflects, or is sympathetic to, human psychology and self-narratization. Sure its less obvious in the less heroic, less epic-y films, but its there in most cases. And in the cases in which it is not present, or a least less obvious, you get a much smaller audience. There's a reason superhero and fantasy films are so popular and prevelant. They appeal to some powerful human feelings; and in a complex world, its easier to to take step back from realtt to tell these stories.

Also, all films are political, whether silly escapist fun or not (or maybe especially if they are silly escapist fun.) So there's nothing wrong with pointing to an individual film or the trend it embodies.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

I can't wait until I can write up my opinions about your films! And I promise to completely take you task if you portray women in some bullshit way. I suspect you won't, but just in case. ;)

Me not mentioning 300 at all but being really nitpicky instead

[hrafntinna.livejournal.com]

It's its. Also: imply (last post).

Re: Me not mentioning 300 at all but being really nitpicky instead

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Oh fer the love of evolution, Doctor.

Yeah, my last post has several errors. A lot more than just imply.

[hrafntinna.livejournal.com]

Heh.

[alizarin71.livejournal.com]

What a great movie. OK, not. But, as I was saying last night, I actually found everything pre/historically fine until the guys showed up with metal tools and weapons. And then the boats. And then the big stone edifices, about 6 or 8,000 years too early. But as soon as someone said "they're from Atlantis" (or the stars, to be fair to my E.T. brethren), I just relaxed and decided I was watching a Conan story.

I agree that the lead woman was kind of a sap. Women from Stone Age-equivalent tribes (19th-c. Amer. Indians, or above-the-falls Amazonians) are stoic and fierce, even if not hunters themselves. And some say that early agricultural societies were matriarchical, so it's not too much of a stretch to claim positions of authority for women in hunter-gatherer groups.

Speaking of women in authority, I disagree that the Old Mother was a passive figure. All that time she was freezing or bleeding, she was using her magic to keep the people safe! And she actively changes things quite a bit at the end, through force of will. (This was a weak story moment, but not on account of her.)

In this paragraph, I will not bring up "300." I will just say that a strong leading woman in that story had the historical leeway to be much more "Girl Power" than they wrote her for. Okay, I guess that is bringing it up.

Does "Terminator 2" count as both being about women and having a band-together theme? "Serenity"? Of course we're just talking about _pop culture_ movies here. Maybe it's our current war-against-the-world era that encourages all these man-vs.-society (lone wolf, superhero) and men-vs.-society (armies, movements) movies. For all that, superhero/loner women are not uncommon.

Of course, "10,000 B.C." was about much, much more than fighting oppressors. It was about fighting weird, alien oppressors. The freakishly large, god-like master needed his pyramids (with the gold nibs at the top) to bring his two dead Atlantean companions (no doubt entombed inside) back to life. The poor, misguided Egyptians built mere copies of these resurrection engines 6,000 years later, without any knowledge of what really made them tick.

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Did I miss something?? Where did you get Atlantis? That's why they were building the pyramids? That was mentioned? Because I missed ALL of that.

I just want to state that I am incredibly cranky (lack of sleep? hormones?) and this is exacerbating my normal annoyance levels. My tolerance for bullshit is very limited.

Thanks for more examples of strong women in film! Still, despite a few examples, you have to admit that it is much harder to find these examples than it is to see strong men in movies. I think that Joss Whedon writes some of the best strong women out there! While he has a cult following, I think it is this very strength of his that keeps him out of the mainstream. Hm, maybe mainstream isn't the best word, but he's not the force he could be were he to capitulate to generic characters and themes. I LOVED "Serenity" for its portrayal of strong women, without the standard American expense of strong men.

And, I agree that 300 is completely flawed. Yup. Totally.

I think that Joss Whedon writes some of the best strong women out there!

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

you'll be interested in this, then....

http://users.livejournal.com/_allecto_/34718.html
A Rapist's View of the World: Joss Whedon and Firefly
This is a really long rant about Joss Whedon's Firefly. Why? Because I'm angry and I think it is really important that feminists don't leave popular culture out of the equation. Especially considering that popular culture is increasingly being influenced by pornography.

Re: I think that Joss Whedon writes some of the best strong women out there!

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Um.... wow, and I thought I was picky. I disagree with her(?). I think Joss is a feminist. But whatever for labels. I wonder what kind of stuff this person does watch on tv or in movies. I mean, I'm obviously an obnoxiously harsh critic, but... wow. There is always room for improvement, and I think slowly we are getting some improvement. As much as I hate to say it, I think even some of the "gratuitous Girl Power" nonsense can be counted as a wee tiny step in the right direction (although, please god, let's move ahead quickly!!).

Re: I think that Joss Whedon writes some of the best strong women out there!

[erinya.livejournal.com]

I just saw that today. That person is way off the mark in her criticism of Whedon and Firefly. She seems to equate penis-vagina sex as rape regardless of consent (to her, any woman who consents to hetero sex has been pressured into man-pleasing by the patriarchy.) It made me especially sad to see her equate feminism with man-hating in her user-info. Way to create bad associations and vindicate those on the frontlines of the Culture Wars who want to make feminism connote misandry. "Witch, please!"

I am kind of a sucker for the "gratuitous Girl Power nonsense" myself, although I agree that we're in this middle stage where female empowerment is the equivalent of women adopting masculine modes of power (violence, aggression, competition.) I think that while women can and when needed should be aggressive and competitive (even violent when force must be answered by force) we have far more to offer than that as leaders in business and politics. I always bring up Starhawk's idea of "power with, not power over" in this context to try to verbalize that distinction and my goal as a feminist, particularly in relation to men.

Re: I think that Joss Whedon writes some of the best strong women out there!

[hrafntinna.livejournal.com]

I just read that. Wow, how astonishingly annoying. I honestly can't imagine what would count as a feminist film in her eyes.

[(Anonymous)]

Please, please, please, please VACCINATE THE PENIS INSIDE YOU!

(I feel strongly about this issue)

I have yet to see 10,000 BC. Jay's archy dept was all hot to see it on opening night, but opted for bowling instead at the last minute! Not srue what that was about. The movie is likely still on the horizon. :-) Jay loves cheesy ridiculous and inaccurate psuedo archaeology films. In Corsica they have evening theater via the LCD projector on the outside wall of the ranger station (complete with bugs flying through the light beam, truly creepy) and Jay makes the undergrads watch all the Indiana Jones movies.

Lots of great roles for women there.

Not! Ha.

Despite this, we will be seeing Indy on opening night and I'll be sure to blog a review. :-)

and I still haven't seen 300 (please don't hate me!)

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

You made me laugh out loud so hard I had to hold my belly! Oh I'd love to hear what Jay has to say about the film! My boss has a PhD in near eastern archeology (specialty: egyptology!) and he's going to see it. Can't wait. I'm sure Jay will get a kick out of it.

When does the next Indy movie open? I love those too.

As for vaccinations, can't promise anything yet! Sorry. However, I was vaccinated and I turned out just fine.

[(Anonymous)]

oo! love to hear what your boss has to say!

Indy is Friday of memorial day weekend. :-)

I challenge you to find any reputable evidence that any potential dangers of vaccination come anywhere near the danger (particularly to society as a whole) of not vaccinating! But whenever you get around to it. :-)

[erinya.livejournal.com]

It's not that I hate men, it's that I loathe the patriarchy.

*cheers* Exactly.

No matter how silly the movie, I still think it qualifies as a candidate for feminist criticism. I haven't seen 10,000 BC (wasn't planning on it, read it was simply awful) but totally agree with you about the passive-female trope. What's worse is how hard it is to get away from--as a writer, I've often had to consciously examine my characters and plots for this and found a LOT of it lurking about.

I also feel you on the excessive white-maleness of movies, by men, about me, for men. Have you heard of the Mo Movie Measure (http://www.amptoons.com/blog/the-mo-movie-measure/)? I just discovered it the other day while reading about something completely different (I love the internet.) To pass, a movie must 1) feature at least two named female characters, who 2) talk to each other about 3) something other than a man. I now feel the need to seek out movies which fulfill these criteria.

*uses King Arthur icon somewhat ironically*

Hrafntinna goes gadfly

[hrafntinna.livejournal.com]

I just wondered what you all thought about this one. One of my all-time favorite movies is Laurence of Arabia. There are no women in it at all. Problem? Why or why not?

Re: Hrafntinna goes gadfly

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

Great question! I haven't seen that film for 15+ years, but I remember it being astonishingly good. At some point I will watch it again and then be able to tell you.

For me, I'm just tired of all male movies. The general trend. But that doesn't discount brilliance in film making. No Country for Old Men is pretty all men, by men, but it was one of the best movies I've seen in ages. I also recently watched Joyeaux Noel, a French film about WWI, with only one female character in it (a small role, but an opera singer!) and it was also excellent. Obviously that particular story, about men in the trenches, could only be all men. I guess I'm saying all men movies doesn't disqualify a film in my eyes. I just wish there were more movies made by women, about women, that weren't "chick flicks." And discounted accordingly!

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

Hey!!!

A film for you! (and for me!!!!)
http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/film/2008/03/blood_on_the_scrolls_alexandri.html


Agora stars our own Rachel Weisz as the fourth-century AD Neoplatonist philosopher, astronomer and editor Hypatia. A famous scholar in a city of scholars, she was caught up in the violent religious tensions that prevailed, and blamed by the rising Christian movement for poor relations between the Alexandrian bishop and the imperial Roman prefect. In The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, Edward Gibbon described her death thus, "On a fatal day, in the holy season of Lent, Hypatia was torn from her chariot, stripped naked, dragged to the church and inhumanly butchered by the hands of Peter the Reader and a troop of savage and merciless fanatics: her flesh was scraped from her bones with sharp oyster shells and her quivering limbs were delivered to the flames."

[ewigweibliche.livejournal.com]

WOW!! Awesome! I will go see that! The article also says the writers have, naturally, inserted a romantic subplot: Hypatia's slave, Davus, is, according to the makers, "torn between his secret love for her and the freedom he could attain by joining the rising tide of Christianity". Insert EYE ROLL here. But still.... moving in the right direction!

[snowcalla.livejournal.com]

hey...there's gotta be a little love in it. Movies are all about relationships. (Although Hypatia wouldn't have had a relationship since she though the body was gross and loving another body even grosser) So this romantic subplot will probably be about unrequited love.